A Sad Day

by hootie4170, Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:18:59 PM EST

I just wanted to say how depressing it is that on a site dedicated to electing Democrats it has four and half diaries on the rec list that either accuse, make fun of, slam or belittle our Democratic nominee.  On the other hand Hillary Clinton is represented in three of them, all in a positive way.

I'm all for talking about our differences in Obama's policy decisions, however some of you just can't wait for something controversial to pop up so you can diary it and get your fix on bashing the Democratic nominee.  Many of you "claim" that you will vote and support Obama, but I never see any positive statements about him from most of you, just the so-called "concerns".

Finally, I am fed up with Hillary would have done this or Hillary would have never done that...We will never know.  Hillary is an outstanding politician and I am thrilled she and her husband on our side but our nominee is Barack Obama.  If you want want to discuss issues on a mature and rational level, I'm all for it...But if you are just here to demean and degrade the nominee for your own personal satisfaction be prepared to be called out.




Tags: Clinton, Obama (all tags)

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Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 2)

Yeah, see ya, MyDD.  It's a big Internet out there, and I can't help but wonder why I've wasted my time here.  

I know, I know, don't let the door hit my ass on the way out.


by tommyslax on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:27:18 PM EST

Re: A Sad Day (1.83 / 6)

I'm thinking the same.  I haven't posted as much lately, because almost every time I log on the main diaries are either ones slamming Obama or comparing Obama to HRC.  I'm tired of defending him against the same swarth of people.  I'm trying to look at this election and primary in historical terms. An AA and a woman were two of three finalists and we have a chance to elect the first minority as POTUS in the history of the USA...Plus get out of Bush's clusterfuck...I'm excited about 2009, wish others were as well.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:32:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hootie, my diary was not really meant (2.00 / 3)

as a "slam" against Obama -- I'm still supporting him. There are about 16,000 people on MyBO (most of them long-time Obama supporters) who are upset, too. And I admitted I was disappointed in Hillary's position on faith-based initiatives. I also said I couldn't be sure what she'd be doing right now, if she'd become the nominee. I was very critical of Obama, but I think legitimate criticism is a healthy thing. His FISA stance will not diminish my support.


Even John McCain lusts after teh engels.
by sricki on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:37:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hootie, my diary was not really meant (2.00 / 2)

I too an just as critical of Hillary's position on faith based initiatives.  I think it is wrong to give tax dollars to institutions that aren't taxed themselves.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:38:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Agreed 100%. (2.00 / 3)

Not a pleasant thing, if you ask me.


Even John McCain lusts after teh engels.
by sricki on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:40:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hootie, my diary was not really meant (none / 0)

Should we not give tax dollars and grants to private universities for clinical research?

Should we not publicly fund institutions like cancer societies, HIV/AIDS relief organizations and food banks/homeless shelters?

All these organizations don't receive tax money but many do obtain public funding....


by Neglected Duty on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 02:03:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hootie, my diary was not really meant (2.00 / 4)

No disrespect intended sricki...Many things people on this site raise as concerns are well-founded and deserve to be talked about.  I hope it can be done civilly and with an open-mind that's all...Oh and it would be nice to see us going after McCain and his positions as well.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:30:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I will go after McCain again soon, (2.00 / 3)

but tomorrow or Sunday I'll be writing a very positive pro-Obama diary. All my venting has made me feel much better. Certainly more optimistic.


Even John McCain lusts after teh engels.
by sricki on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:33:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I will go after McCain again soon, (2.00 / 2)

Sorry if you took offense.  Absolutely none was intended toward you:)


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:50:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

But we need you Hootie. As you know it is so easy to take over this site. It is amazing how much time we spend defending our candidate on this site


by Politicalslave on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 06:59:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

Hootie, can you honestly say that Obama is turning out to be anything like the candidate you thought you were supporting prior to his becoming the presumptive nominee?


by phoenixdreamz on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 11:16:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

Honestly phoenix, yes. As in any other election year during the primary you shoot for your base which includes mostly Democrats because some of the states have closed primaries.  So basically your campaigning for the Democratic vote and in open primaries you change your campaigning to reach out to independents and moderate Repubs.  

It's a different story in the GE.  You have to move to the center in order to widen your net of possible voters and to lessen the turnout for your opponent.  Simply put it is a strategy necessary to win the POTUS.  Once he gets into office I believe he will shift back to the left and promote the liberal agenda.  I was under no false pretenses in the primary.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 01:36:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

It would be more accurate to say that "politicians move to the right to win the general election." Hence you see Barack Obama moving right, and John McCain moving further right, both in an apparent attempt to appeal to the Republican base.


by souvarine on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 02:06:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

...the McCain adviser said the campaign will target male and female blue-collar white Democrats, a group viewed by Republicans as Obama's soft spot.

"They already sense that [Obama] may be too liberal," the adviser added. "They tend to also agree with McCain on the war and on social issues and we'll have to satisfy them that McCain agrees with them on the economy."

"The bulk of the Democrats you would try to appeal to are not Harvard-educated lawyers who are feminists. They're working class Democrats that you have more of a shot at getting. And the core of that appeal is social conservatism, right to life, Second Amendment, and obviously national security," Donatelli said.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/030 8/9229_Page2.html


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 02:20:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

Certain groups of Democrats are cross-pressured? Yeah, I'm aware of that, but Barack Obama will never out-Republican a Republican on those issues. Obama's problem with blue-collar voters is not that he is too liberal on social issues, it is that he is too conservative on economic issues.

Granted many of blue-collar voters are Democrats, so my "Republican base" crack was simplistic, but the point is that both Obama and McCain have chosen to fight on right-wing ground, and they are both moving to the right, not to the center.


by souvarine on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 02:34:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

He may have to tread into the conservative territory in order to win the GE

Twenty-four percent (24%) of the nation's voters are both fiscally and socially conservative. Twenty percent (20%) are both fiscally and socially moderate. Fifteen percent (15%) of all voters are fiscally moderate and socially liberal. Two groups of voters each include 10% of the voting population--those who are fiscally conservative and socially moderate along with those who are fiscally moderate and socially conservative.* Nine percent (9%) are fiscally and socially liberal.*

http://rasmussenreports.com/public_conte nt/politics/election_20082/2008_presiden tial_election/daily_presidential_trackin g_poll


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 02:42:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (1.25 / 8)

If you want to hang out with people who fall in line at the drop of a hat and are proud to parrot the li(n)es of their leadership, the GOP will be glad to welcome you.

Otherwise, get used to watching Barack Obama get shredded.  He's not God, you know.  He's not even good.


by SuperCameron on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:42:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

He's not God, you know.

Really?  Really?  Darn, I guess we'll have to give the nomination to Hillary then.  That was the only reason why I was voting for him.

He's not even good.

But tell us how you really feel.


by Can I Haz Moar Snark on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:26:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

Have a great 4th of July!


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:31:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

Super Cameron Which Democrats do you represent?


by Politicalslave on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 05:16:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

It is difficult (none / 0)

to avoid the conclusion that though they claim otherwise, many Clinton supporters really want Obama to lose.


by fladem on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 07:18:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It is difficult (none / 0)

where did you pull that "conclusion" out of off?  Your behind?

most democrats have bitched and moaned over candidates for decades.  It is what proudly separates us from the republicans.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 07:25:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 2)

The vocal minority are an annoying bunch of people.  You're best option, since they represent no one but themselves, is to just ignore them.

Believe me, no one else cares what they think, since there are so few, that's why they always make a fuss about nothing.


by RussTC3 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 09:38:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

we are thin skinned, aren't we? (none / 0)


by suzieg on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 06:20:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: we are thin skinned, aren't we? (none / 0)

Nope just fed up...


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 01:36:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 6)

It's the Fourth of July, when the Founding Fathers chose to stand on principle and revolt, rather than make more political compromises with King George.

Surely today it is appropriate to hold our nominee to the principles this nation was founded on?


by souvarine on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:31:47 PM EST

hold our nominee to the principles (2.00 / 4)

While giving McBush a free pass and carrying his dirty water.


by Beren on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:33:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 5)

Yeah, I get it....After 139 FISA diaries I get it...Just thought today could be more of a "Let's Go Get 'Em Barack" day....


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:34:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

It is more than just FISA. Some of us are Democrats for a reason, you know.


by souvarine on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:40:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 4)

I understand people have legitimate concerns about Obama as do I.  I never once thought he and I would have the exact same views on everything.  However, I still believe he is determined to chart a new course for our country including fixing the economy, creating more jobs, getting out of Iraq, pushing for universal healthcare, better schools, etc.  And I am excited about that especially having endured the last 7+ with Dubya...I'm also excited our country has taken a huge step in believing a woman and AA are qualified to lead our country, most underestimate what we, as a country, accomplished during the primary season.  Was their still sexism and racism? Hell yes, but just the mere fact that an AA and a woman were the last two standing on the Democratic side speaks volumes, at least it does to me.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:48:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 10)

We're Democrats because we're not republicans. People spend more time bashing Obama than they bother with McCain, and they do it with far more vitriol. Our nominee is not "King George," nor do we need to "revolt" against our own party because of freaking FISA.

And when I see the same Obama-haters posting the same comments, the same diaries, and giving the same TRs to us, it makes it quite ridiculous to couch their actions in such sacred historical context. People without credibility aren't afforded such deference.

This is nothing more than a bunch of people trying turn our election into a grand game of I-told-you-so, the real facts or stakes be damned.


by Johnny Gentle Famous Crooner on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:00:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 4)

Interestingly, McCain is for the extension of Bush's administration, which thus far has been the closest thing to fascism in a long time, if not ever.  I think there are legitimate concerns by our posters but then the other "supporters" grasp on to that to implement repub attack plans about flip flops, destroying the constitution, general denigration of Obama, and whispers of not voting or supporting Obama.

July 4th, the date commemorating the revolt against a tyranical government and he we are bashing the guy who represents our desire to rid the country of our present day tyranny.


Please don't associate moose with Palin, she likes to kill them.
by KLRinLA on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:05:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

and 412 whiny diaries sobbing about the rec list is sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooo meaningful and helpful...


by zerosumgame on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:55:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 5)

Have a great 4th of July


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:56:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'll never forgive him for his comment that (none / 0)

abortion should be illegal for a woman who suffers from mental distress! He should ask Bill Frist to be his VP!


by suzieg on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 06:22:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'll never forgive him for his comment that (2.00 / 2)

So go vote for McCain.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 08:01:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

yeah, all the while framing it as if Obama drafted this legislation.  Oddly, in all o fthese diaries I rarely see anyone pointing out all of the other House members who let this crap get to the Senate.  Barack will hopefully work with dodd and others to strip the immunity like he said.  I am willing to wait and see waht he does before I throw him and the election in the fire.  Let's also hold all the others accountable for their actions, who should bear most of the blame as oppossed to trashing Obama

On the other hand I have no problem with the FISA group on Obama's website talling him what they want.  BUt to condemn him before his vote and work to strip the immunity is a little extreme in my opinion.


Please don't associate moose with Palin, she likes to kill them.
by KLRinLA on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:42:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You're that naive to believe that he'll try to (1.50 / 2)

cut out the tel com immunity out of the bill? It's a done deal, he's voting for it! His response was only to quiet the dissent that is being reported in the media and makes him look bad! The man has shown over and over again that he has no principles!


by suzieg on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 06:24:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You're that naive to believe that he'll try to (2.00 / 1)

Bullshit...you see what you want to see...


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 01:38:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

Revolt against McCain or Bush not OUR candidate.


by Politicalslave on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 05:07:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

a site dedicated to electing Democrats (2.00 / 6)

Apparently not.


by Beren on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:31:53 PM EST

We're a nation of laws, not of men (1.66 / 6)

You have to understand he is morphing from a Democrat into something else entirely. Do you understand this?

So this site is supposed to help elect Democrats.


by catfish2 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:48:14 PM EST

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 4)

He's doing what he needs to do to garner votes and win the election.  Would you rather him go hardcore liberal in his campaigning and lose the election, just so we can say well he said everything we (liberals) wanted to hear too bad he lost but he can help us in the senate under a McCain presidency.

People don't understand he needs those swing voters (moderates) in order to win the GE.  He needs to win first before he can implement his agenda.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:53:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 3)

no one is stating he has to go hardcore liberal - he should have just stated the way he was in the primaries.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:55:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 4)

Tell me a politician who hasn't maneuvered to the center in the GE and won?  In order to win the GE you have to gravitate that way to widening your net, it is just strategy.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:58:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 4)

lately, is more than just to the center - he has been going right of the center and crossing over into dangerous territory.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:03:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 3)

"no one is stating he has to go hardcore liberal - he should have just stated the way he was in the primaries."

He did. You just weren't paying attention. Obama has never run as a hardcore liberal - he's always run as a pragmatist who works to find common ground across political lines in order to get good things done. I think that a lot of people must have tuned out whenever he talked about being post-partisan, but he really meant it.


by laird on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:08:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 4)

huh?  You quoted my comment and I know he didn't run as a hardcore lib.  He is a centrist.  

but now he is moving beyond being a centrist and that is running to the right and I am not pleased about it.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:14:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 2)

Hootie, it's a Dem year.  There are 4 registered Dems for every 3 registered Repubs.  He can be the Dem candidate.


Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:55:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "Doing what he needs to do"... (2.00 / 3)

Is that sort of like:
"will do anything to win "?
by susie on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:33:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "Doing what he needs to do"... (2.00 / 3)

Yep, and I hope he does.  We NEED a Democrat in the WH.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:55:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

So it was OK for Obama to say that Clinton (2.00 / 1)

would do anything to get the nomination but now there's no outrage when he does the same thing! Double standard anyone?


by suzieg on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 06:27:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So it was OK for Obama to say that Clinton (none / 0)

It's called politics...How about when she said he was elitist and out of touch or McCain has passed the threshold and Obama hasn't on being CIC.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 01:40:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 4)

"he is morphing from a Democrat into something else entirely"

No, he's been consistently a moderate who finds common ground with his 'opponents' in order to get good things done. If you thought that he was a purist who stood absolute stands on principle, you haven't been paying attention. I'd suggest reading his books, or perhaps reading  his speeches over the years.

While I wish that he was a bit more of a progressive, I'd certainly rather have the President be a Democrat that can engage in reasonable, intelligent discussions and can get things done than whatever you'd characterize McCain as.


by laird on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:03:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 1)

I swear, has the country gotten brainwashed or something?

Obama is ALREADY a moderate.  The country is not right of center.  Where Obama is going is right of center, as he is already in the f'ing center!!

god, some people are blind.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:04:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 2)

"Where Obama is going is right of center"

I think that you missed the point of my post, which is that Obama hasn't changed. What he's saying now is the same as he was saying last year. He hasn't repositioned himself for the general election.

What's going on how is that Obama is being attacked now by people pursuing their own agendas. The right wing is attacking him for "flip-flops" because that attack has worked for them before. And the left wing is attacking him for being insufficiently liberal. With any luck the two cancel each other out, and Obama wins by appealing to the mainstream voters who don't like either extreme.


by laird on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:13:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (2.00 / 3)

no, what Obama did was not talk about the issues in the way he is talking about them NOW.

he had a different "plan" then in the primaries OR he never once talked about them in detailed (such as the faith-based stuff).

if he had talked about the issues then as he does now, no way would he have gotten the so-called progressive voters to vote for him.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:15:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Won't work because of his repeated attacks (2.00 / 1)

on Clinton during the debates and on the campaign trail and now taking the very same stand as he critized her for. People are not stupid!  His non-stop ads paid by his millions are ingrained in people minds - they know he's flip flopping all over the place! He's coming across as a genuine hypocrite!


by suzieg on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 06:31:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Won't work because of his repeated attacks (none / 0)

Man I bet you're a treat at work..


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 01:42:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

uh huh. (2.00 / 1)

So what was your reason for opposing him before?


by MeganLocke on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:42:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Just that he's ever-morphing (none / 0)

and you can't tell if he's Democrat Republican or what. In fact I don't think he knows. But mainly this bothers me in how he'll deal with foreign policy.


by catfish2 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:56:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just that he's ever-morphing (2.00 / 5)

Which is why you're voting for McCain... we've got it already.  Let's defeat Barky!  Bam Bam is going down in flames!  Who's with me!!?!??

Anyone?  Buehler?


And so, may evil beware and may good dress warmly and eat lots of fresh vegetables.
by thatpurplestuff on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:01:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'll vote for the Democrat (none / 0)

as soon as I can figure out who that is. Is it Nader? McCain? Obama? Barr?


by catfish2 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 05:34:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'll vote for the Democrat (2.00 / 1)

It's McCain...


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 06:14:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Just that he's ever-morphing (2.00 / 4)

That's sort of the same right-wing frame that was used to take down Kerry.

Why do you hate Democratic candidates so much?


by Can I Haz Moar Snark on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:29:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I liked John Kerry, voted for him (none / 0)

canvassed for him.


by catfish2 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 05:33:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Yet (2.00 / 1)

wasn't he just as "right wing" as Obama is now?


The American people; they were for the war before they were against it.
by nrafter530 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 05:59:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Because he's a fake! (1.00 / 2)


by suzieg on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 06:32:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Because he's a fake! (none / 0)

Go vote for McCain then.  We get it you don't like Obama.  Thanks for pointing that out every chance you get.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 08:03:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Because he's a fake! (none / 0)

I know!  Jesus Christ it's all day with this one.  


by MeganLocke on Mon Jul 07, 2008 at 05:14:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We're a nation of laws, not of men (none / 0)

Catfish That's basically what McCain just said.
He isn't the man we thought he was.
by Politicalslave on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 05:19:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 11)

A sad Groundhog Day all over again. MyDD looks more and more like some kind of 'bizzaro Redstate' website than a distinctly left-wing of the Democratic Party website.

If the distinction between Democrats and Republicans has morphed into just being mirror image 'opposites' then we are well and truly screwed. The trashing of Obama for his reasoned and well-articulated stands on the various issues confronting the world is not a good sign.

The trolls are bad people, but they aren't the scariest problem. The "absolutist-purity my way or no-way knee-jerk echo-chamber our-turn mad-as-hell at the Bush regime so now let's base our entire platform on the most liberal talking points we can think of and hammer Obama for any deviation from that" diarists and commentators are tiresome, boring, and wrong.

We have a candidate. Be practical. Work to get him elected, or risk the consequences.


by xdem on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:48:54 PM EST

You know .... (2.00 / 13)

most of us freely acknowledge that we will be voting for Obama, and are in support of Obama.

I have even gone on record as stating that I do NOT want Hillary to be the VP pick, I prefer she have a different role.

I have also gone on record here as telling the PUMA folks to STOP, and have called several of them out on their selfish behavior.

However, that does not mean that I cannot speak out when I do not see eye to eye with our nominee, nor does it mean that I have to sit back and watch folks STILL try to rewrite history and make Bill Clinton's record 'shit'.

But I do understand your concerns.  However, we are here to promote Democratic ideals,and some of us are more progressive than some of us thought, and some of us seem to not be as progressive as once was imagined.

Happy 4th, let the founding fathers objectives, goals and aspirations for America ring still today!


Hell's bells, even the GOP didn't have to crucify Eisenhower's record in order to make Reagan their 'saint'. We can have two great ones, you know?
by emsprater on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:50:20 PM EST

Re: You know .... (2.00 / 4)

Wasn't meant for you...your discussions always seem relevant and I'm glad you bring them up.  Happy 4th to you as well.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:56:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Why are PUMAs selfish? Because they think (1.00 / 1)

Obama is the weakest candidate? Because they're mad at the democratic party for being less than democratic as a result of the May 31 coup? Because they want ALL the votes to be counted? Because they want the candidate who legitimately won the most votes? You forget that Obama was selected by the SDs not by the voters so why shouldn't they revolt? Why shouldn't they want transparency in their party?

Have you watched the videos of the Unity day in NH? Great show of democracy when Obama's surrogates told the Hillary's supporters to go and stand 1/4 mile away from the event and took away their signs! I'm glad they exist and hope they raise hell at the convention! No coronation for the selected nominee! He's reaping what he sowed...


by suzieg on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 06:39:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why are PUMAs selfish? Because they think (none / 0)

Boo Freakin Hoo...Cry me a river...


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 01:43:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

Some of the feelings are genuine - there are a fair number of people disappointed by recent events.  Some of it is message control.  The fact is that a certain non-posting contingent that I like to call the Ghost Patrol long ago discovered the flaws in the rec system and now exploit those flaws to keep various divisive diaries at the top of the list.  That is one of the reasons why, on some days, it seems like the primary wars continue here unabated.


by rfahey22 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:51:26 PM EST

Re: A Sad Day (1.66 / 6)

it is a sad day when the democratic nominee looks more like a republican than a democrat lately.

some of his positions and statements are horrific.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 02:51:59 PM EST

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

How does he look like more of a Repub on the top issues?

The economy, war in Iraq, Healthcare, National Security, Immigration, Education where does he look like more like a GOP than a Dem on these issues?


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:03:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

His latest comments this past couple of weeks have sounded like shit from a republican.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:05:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

Give me examples on the issues that I mentioned above?  You know the ones that Americans say are their top ones.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:07:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 2)

well, I am an American and women rights are at the top of my list.  Not happy with his "mental distress" comment at all.

and FISA - did he "unite" the House to vote against it?  I guess I will have to wait until he is president to start uniting.

and what about the stupid faith based shit - if we are going to give millions of dollars to religious institutions now, I want them taxed as well.

Iraq - he isn't going to get us out there anytime soon, based on his latest comments.  


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:10:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

So your more in tune with McGaffe's position on women's rights?

FISA is going to pass any way, period.  He will fight the telecom immunity.

Faith Based Iniatives were endorsed by HRC and many Dems as well.

He will get us out of Iraq.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:22:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

"It was going to happen anyway" is the worst rationale ever.  Seriously.

He is voting the wrong way.  No excuse.


McCain = bad Obama = good
by CAchemist on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:30:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

what the fuck are you talking about?  Who the fuck are you talking to?

I am voting for Obama, not McCain.  I am also {gasp, OMG} criticizing him for pandering to the righties by acting like one.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:31:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

As reported by the AP (2.00 / 2)

On the abortion story. They also reported the faith-based story stating he would let charities discriminate based on faith - a flat-out lie on their part. They've done this repeatedly and I don't trust their interpretation of the abortion story.

How is he going to "unite the House", he's a Senator? You do realize he has no control over what happens in the House because he's in the Senate, right?

Iraq - he isn't going to get us out there anytime soon, based on his latest comments.  

I give up! Are you for real?


Hillary is voting for Obama, so why aren't you?
by BrighidG on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:24:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: As reported by the AP (none / 0)

Barack is the defacto leader of the party now.  He could, if he wanted, force the hands of democrats in the house and make them vote his way.  He didn't do this because he knows it would hurt centrist democrats reelection chances.  But to be clear he could do it if he wanted to.


McCain = bad Obama = good
by CAchemist on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:29:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: As reported by the AP (2.00 / 2)

No he could not.  Bill Clinton, as President, couldn't get half of his early legislation passed when Democrats controlled the Senate - there's no way that Barack Obama with about a quarter of the power could force the hands of democrats in the house.

He just can't.  And when people say "clearly" or "it's clear", that's usually a sign that what's about to follow is rank speculation.


by MeganLocke on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:44:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: As reported by the AP (none / 0)

I speculate that if Obama had challenged the house democrats from a large public venue and got lots of media attention (which he always does), he would have been able to force many democrats to flip.  It would have risked his credibility but that is why it may have worked.  Once again, pure speculation.


McCain = bad Obama = good
by CAchemist on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:50:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

No (none / 0)

This is someone who had to wait till early June to secure the nomination. And if he had attempted that and failed, the MSM would have bleated: "Obama wants to unite the country, can't unite own party!" From now until November.

It was Pelosi's job to deliver the House and it's Obama's job to vote against FISA immunity but anything more is over-reaching, IMO.


Hillary is voting for Obama, so why aren't you?
by BrighidG on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 11:41:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: As reported by the AP (2.00 / 1)

your abuse has been reported


by zerosumgame on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 05:23:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

what abuse???!!! (none / 0)

Because she said someone was speculating.  That's pretty hyper-sensitive, don't you think?


by thurst on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 08:34:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: As reported by the AP (none / 0)

He can't because many of the Dem reps in the house and senate probably went along with Bush's scheme about warrantless wiretapping right after 9-11 in a knee jerk reaction.  Many are voting Yea just to get the whole mess behind them, IMO.  I think their are many Dem reps neck deep in this whole FISA shit.


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:39:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You need to brush-up on your civics (none / 0)

Reid and Pelosi = leaders of the party.

Obama = possible leader of the party but till November 5th, he's nothing but a junior Senator with great potential.


Hillary is voting for Obama, so why aren't you?
by BrighidG on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 11:38:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Sorry for the snarky title to first response (none / 0)

Read too quickly, thought you were colebiancardi.


Hillary is voting for Obama, so why aren't you?
by BrighidG on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 11:43:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

I will give you the "mental distress" and FISA.  These are issues he is wrong on.

I think religious groups do great works and if they can help make our society better without openly pushing their religion on you, we should help them.  It is much more cost effective to fund already running soup kitchens than to start from scratch.

And Iraq.  He has not shifted at all.  Not even 0.1%.  Anybody that says he is was not paying attention for the last 12 months or only heard what they wanted to hear.  His position in a nutshell is:  When he becomes President he will change the mission in Iraq to withdraw.  He will then discuss the new mission with Generals on the ground to develop the withdrawal strategy.  He thinks this can  be done in about 16 months but has always left the door open to longer if a shorter time would put soldiers lives in jeopardy.  Please link me to his recent comments that go against this policy.


McCain = bad Obama = good
by CAchemist on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:26:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 3)

Well said, especially in regards to Iraq. Those who are accusing him of shifting are not really paying attention IMO, just wanting to add a complaint to their list.

I agree that it was unnecessary and a bummer that he wants to exclude "mental distress" from pregnancy concerns. That opens the door.

I also wish he took a risk and came down on the other side of FISA, but I also acknowledge that he needs to be careful how he represents himself on national security for the general. The right wing will most likely try to paint him as weak on terrorism because of the Iraq withdraw plan. He is probably looking for ways to prevent them from "connecting the dots" with too many other stances that could be sound-bited into soft on terrorists. I think he has the skills to pull off explaining how the protection of constitutional rights, even in the arena of spying on potential terrorists, actually strengthens our hand in the overall struggle. Despite my disappointment, I still believe at this point that he will work toward correcting the overstepping of the executive branch once he wins.

Like you, I actually support the faith-based charity stance because I think it is a more efficient way to get help to the needy than by relying on government-organized programs. Of course, it won't be perfectly efficient, but hey, I'd rather give money to the needy than build bombs any day.


by glopster on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:21:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

Maybe you should inform yourself instead of spreading smears about Obama.

Obama yesterday: "I will bring our troops out at a pace of one to two brigades per month and at that pace we will have our combat troops out in 16 months."


by EnzoValenzetti on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 05:04:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

I look forward to your detailed, sourced, policy analysis, backing up this claim.


by Dreorg on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:09:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

I look forward to your detailed, sourced, policy analysis backing UP his claims.

Obama doesn't seem to have a position anymore.

am I voting for him?  yeah, and holding my nose.  He is better than McCain.

However, am I pissed off at him?  you bet.  His comments lately have been right of the center.  Not the center.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:12:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 2)

You can always inform yourself here about Obama's positions:
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/
by EnzoValenzetti on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 05:05:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

sigh....yes, I know about his website - I also know what he has been stating lately as well.


by colebiancardi on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 05:16:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

Complain complain complain complain.

You are a one note my friend.  


Consider that everything which happens, happens justly, and if thou observest carefully, thou wilt find it to be so. -Marcus Aurelius
by Blue Neponset on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 08:05:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 2)

It's a sad when when  ahandful of bitter, dead-ender, PUMAS and McTrolls are allowed to hijack a website formerly devoted to helping the nominee of the Democratic Party.


by Beren on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:20:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

Like when he said he would annihilate Iran off the face of the earth? Oh yeah, that wasn't him who said that.


"In the primary you should vote with your heart, but in the general, you should vote with your head" Hillary's husband
by venician on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:56:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

Cole there is no comparison to any Republican.
This is just another example of the Rovian Talking points
by Politicalslave on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 05:23:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

As I said he's reaping what he sowed! (none / 0)

He hasn't won the nomination fair and square so don't expect unity - that is his problem! the SDs gave him the nomination - when you look at the list, the first ones out,  were all given campaign contributions by him, so he basically bought their votes and as good democrats we don't like our nominee to be selected by people who were made to support him because of money!


by suzieg on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 06:44:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: As I said he's reaping what he sowed! (none / 0)

Get over it. Obama won the most votes and the most delegates.

It was Clinton who wanted to overturn the results of the primaries with an SD coup.


by EnzoValenzetti on Sat Jul 05, 2008 at 12:10:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 4)

Hey honey , today isn't a sad day , its a day to celebrate the country we all love ( or at least most of us ).

A day to celebrate the greatest country on the face of the planet.

Stay away from the blogs today , enjoy the day .

No need to be out of kilter today.


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:00:16 PM EST

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

Thanks sweetie...I'm just so sick of Dubya, I can't wait for 2009!

Have a great 4th!!


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:05:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (none / 0)

Hey honey

OMG teh sexism!!!!


by Can I Haz Moar Snark on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 04:34:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 4)

yeah- seems like we have digressed more than ever recently. but hey if you;re not part of the solution   then you're part of the problem. so everyone needs to stop commenting on the bullshit flame war diaries and ignore them. that and you got to write more positive diaries to combat the shittyness.[the fact is, most people here love the controversy. issue diaries go overlooked-]

so that being said, i got a diary in the works! and i never write diaries.


by alyssa chaos on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:00:41 PM EST

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

Looking forward to it:)


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:05:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

Does this diarist think it was good, then, that Democrats stayed silent and only said positive things about John Kerry when the Swift Boat Liars were doing their thing too and Kerry was just chuckling about it?

Bushies also think only good things must be said about him too.

Saying it makes it so hasn't worked real well.


by Juno on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:02:06 PM EST

Boo Frickin Hoo (none / 0)

Just because he is the nominee doesn't mean we have to close our eyes and cover our ears and close our mouths.

I will vote for your guy, but it doesn't mean I have to like it.


On the train thanks to HRC...
by BRockNYC on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:03:06 PM EST

Re: Boo Frickin Hoo (2.00 / 1)

Have a great 4th of July!


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:08:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 1)

Hey diarist.

Today is a great day for all americans! democrats, republicans & independents.

Since when did the 4th of July celebrations become Barack Obama day!

Relax. Stay offline for today.

You had too much to drink.

P.S. Just be thankful that we are not seeing
 " Buyers Remorse" among democrats. Obama better remember how "idealistic" his fans are. He better ask their permission before changing his positions weekly.

Obama seems to be outpacing the young Governor Bill Clinton in 1992 in his rapid move to the center.


by labanman on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:08:24 PM EST

Re: A Sad Day (2.00 / 2)

Thanks labaman...Don't drink though...your right there is much to be happy about, thanks for the reality check!  Happy 4th to you!


A useless "Community Organizer" from Pennsylvania as noted by Republicans, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin
by hootie4170 on Fri Jul 04, 2008 at 03:12:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]